Writing for money, or...

    At Parakleitos's suggestion, I am cross-posting my LJ entry, so that we can discuss it in this forum.

    Samuel Johnson said, "No man but a blockhead ever wrote, except for money."

    Harlan Ellison said, "The amateurs are the ones who give their stories away, because they want to be recognized; and that's fine, I suppose, if they want to be patsies, but then when the time comes for a publisher to pay, the well has been poisoned, and the publisher says, 'Well, everybody else gave us their story. Why do you want a fee?' And I say, 'well, Cowboy, just because everybody else is a simp, jumped off the cliff, and paid you for the privilege, doesn't mean I'm going do it. I'm a pro, mudduhfugguh, and you can prey on the ignorance and hayseed naïveté of these hungry fish, but not me. Pay me!' "

    Nicola Griffith said, "If you're a writer, stop and think for a minute: who is profiting from the time you're donating? From your name? You can bet someone is. Make sure it's you. . . . I write fiction for the art, for free, for love. For myself. Anyone else who wants access pays."

    I sympathize more with Ellison and Griffith than I do with Johnson. Their point is that professionals should be paid for their work and not be exploited.

    Granted.

    However, the fact of the matter is -- the fact of the matter has always been -- that only a tiny percentage of writers and artists are able to support themselves on their writing. Even if every publisher, producer, viewer and reader in the world were to consent to pay for every word or moment they produced, published, viewed or read, and that money went directly to the writer and no one else, the great majority of writers would not earn a living wage from their writing. So for those who are good enough, or lucky enough, or just persistent enough to reach that goal, I say that Ellison and Griffith are right on target: get paid for everything you do.

    But someone like me is in a different position. I'm 49, I have a full-time job and adult commitments, and am just getting started in the writing. The chance that I will be able to support my family on my writing is nearly zero. The chance that I'll be able to do it on short stories alone is exactly zero. If I'm very, very good at it, work hard, constantly improve, and also luck out, I may earn a few thousand a year. But it will never pay my mortgage, put my kids through college or significantly aid in my retirement. (Middle-class, Western goals? Yeah: I'm a middle-class, Western fellow. Sorry.)

    So, okay, why do I want to write? I want to write so that others will read. I want people to see the things I see, imagine the things I imagine, react to them, play with them, fight with them.

    Here is my thought-experiment:

    • If someone said, "I will pay you $10 million per year for your writing, on the condition that you give it to me without showing it to anyone else, and that I will lock it away so that no one will ever read it" -- I would refuse. (Okay: I think I would refuse; no one's ever offered me $10 million…)
       
    • If someone said, "I will guarantee that a million people every year will read what you write, respond to it, care about it, play with it, and communicate back to you about it, on the condition that you never get a dime from it and must earn your bread by some other means" -- I would accept.
       

    Sure, it's an unrealistic set of hypotheticals; no one's going to offer me any such thing. But it's designed to force the issue and highlight what my priorities are.

    I don't think I'm a blockhead, or a simp, or a patsy, or a hayseed, or any of the other things Harlan Ellison loves to call people who do things differently than he does.

    That is the bottom line. I write so that people will read. I would love to make my living by writing; it would be a fantastic dream. I would be proud and joyful to not have to do anything but writing. But ultimately, that is not why I write. I write so that others will read. Period.
     

    Comments

    Ellison sounds like a

    Ellison sounds like a complete douche. And Griffith, if she writes for herself and wants others to pay to see her work, well good luck with that. Getting your book published is like getting a recording contract. Sometimes it just has to do with luck. And unfortunately sometimes crappy writers/artists get contracts (Kevin Federline {WTF!} ). As far as getting paid, if its for original work, then you should try to get paid if you can. And good luck trying. Chances are you will waste more time and money trying to get someone to notice you unless you have good connections. You can't make money if you only write stories from a particular fandom, so that's out.

    Although personally, if I had Bill Gates money, I would pay some authors from this site to "retire" and do nothing more than write and make good progress on the stories written here. Here's to hoping I hit the lotto.

    Rhetor's picture

    hitokirichapin wrote: And

    hitokirichapin wrote:

    And Griffith, if she writes for herself and wants others to pay to see her work, well good luck with that. Getting your book published is like getting a recording contract. Sometimes it just has to do with luck. . . . You can't make money if you only write stories from a particular fandom, so that's out.

    Although personally, if I had Bill Gates money, I would pay some authors from this site to "retire" and do nothing more than write and make good progress on the stories written here. Here's to hoping I hit the lotto.

    Hey, Alex. I'll pray that your lottery ticket cashes in tomorrow!

    Griffith does pretty well for herself with her novels, so I can't fault her on that score. But I think that Johnson, Ellison and Griffith all share the perspective of writers who are already successful, already making a living at their writing. I think their advice is misleading for those of us (most of us) who have not reached that point.

    If I was writing for money

    If I was writing for money it would become a job and it wouldn't be fun anymore.

    And then all my writing would suck.

    So what's the point?

    parakletos's picture

    Kezzabear wrote: If I was

    Kezzabear wrote:

    If I was writing for money it would become a job and it wouldn't be fun anymore.

    And then all my writing would suck.

    So what's the point?

    Perhaps, perhaps not. I doubt your writing would suck though :)

    Kezzabear wrote: If I was

    Kezzabear wrote:

    If I was writing for money it would become a job and it wouldn't be fun anymore.

    And then all my writing would suck.

    So what's the point?

    I agree with Parakletos. I don't think your writing would suck. I don't know you and I could be wrong, but you don't seem like the type of person who could release a story in which you don't put a good effort in. It all depends on if you wanted to be a writer for a living though. There would definitely be more pressure and I can see why that would affect you. Hell it would affect anybody.

    Chatmandu's picture

    Kezzabear the Author

    I think it would be great if, one day, she writes on the bottom of statuary in a hotel room. :-)

    Rhetor's picture

    Kezzabear wrote: If I was

    Kezzabear wrote:

    If I was writing for money it would become a job and it wouldn't be fun anymore.

    And then all my writing would suck.

    Could be, but I hope not. I mean, it's probably true that then it becomes a job -- meaning something you have to do even when you don't feel like it -- but that can be worthwhile in its own way, and it's possible that the writing quality would remain.

    It's also possible that the fun wouldn't go out of it.

    Rhetor's picture

    Er, what?

    Chatmandu wrote:

    I think it would be great if, one day, she writes on the bottom of statuary in a hotel room. :-)

    Er, what?

    Chatmandu's picture

    My extreme HP geekdom is showing

    Rhetor wrote:

    Er, what?

    When Jo finished the manuscript for Deathly Hallows she was staying at a hotel. She wrote on the bottom of a bust in the room the room number and the date that she finished the story. Don't know what she, or the hotel, did with the bust though.

    Just thinking maybe Kezzabear could be the next popular author. Or you for that matter!

    ROFLOL at the idea I will

    ROFLOL at the idea I will ever be a famous author. But if I ever am, I am so desecrating hotel statuary.

    I just know that I used to make little baby dresses for friend's babies and then my ex said I should make them to sell at the local markets. As soon as I tried I didn't find it fun any longer. It became a chore. I think if I found writing a chore it would therefore not be very good writing.

    rachel's picture

    Writing for money. That

    Writing for money. That would be like performing on command. You'd have to listen to your editor, publisher, etc. They would say "Your last book didn't sell so well." "Start writing about Vampires and call it Naked Once More, Hop to it." Everyone knows anything will sell with the word Naked in the title.

    NotACat's picture

    You ought to know better by now...

    rachel wrote:

    Everyone knows anything will sell with the word Naked in the title.

    "Dolores Umbridge—Naked Ambition"?

    parakletos's picture

    NotACat wrote: rachel

    NotACat wrote:
    rachel wrote:

    Everyone knows anything will sell with the word Naked in the title.

    "Dolores Umbridge—Naked Ambition"?

    And its follow up: 'The Naked Truth'.... *shudders*

    rachel wrote: Writing for

    rachel wrote:

    Writing for money. That would be like performing on command. You'd have to listen to your editor, publisher, etc. They would say "Your last book didn't sell so well." "Start writing about Vampires and call it Naked Once More, Hop to it." Everyone knows anything will sell with the word Naked in the title.

    Piers Anthony writes a newsletter in which he often discusses the ins and outs of dealing with his publishers, and the courses of action he follows as a result. He used to sell his stories on specification, never actually writing a story he hadn't already sold to a publisher. There came a time however when all his publishers wanted was more Xanth stories. Since he had other stories he wanted to be able to tell he investigated other options, specifically self publication through online self-publishing sites such as www.xlibris.com. That allowed him to write stories he wanted to write on the basis that if no other publisher would buy it he would publish it himself.

    As for Ellison, having now read the entire interview the above quote was taken from, my impression of him is that he is somewhat technophobic. Most of what he said makes a lot of sense, but he doesn't seem to have taken into consideration (or was perhaps ignoring as being irrelevant to his point) the fact that every professional writer has to start somewhere, and in this day and age it makes sense that making use of the 'fanzine press' as he puts it is one of the possible steps along that path.

    - SC

    Chatmandu's picture

    The power of titles

    rachel wrote:

    "Start writing about Vampires and call it Naked Once More, Hop to it."

    "Naked Once More" is sort of cliche, don't you think? However, "Naked Once More, Hop to it" has possibilities! :-)

    Didn't "This Means War" have a bit where Harry tries to ignore Ginny's blatant flirting by imagining Umbridge in a bikini? That is a mental picture that is so wrong on so many levels.

    rachel's picture

    Chatmandu wrote: rachel

    Chatmandu wrote:
    rachel wrote:

    "Start writing about Vampires and call it Naked Once More, Hop to it."

    "Naked Once More" is sort of cliche, don't you think? However, "Naked Once More, Hop to it" has possibilities! :-)

    Didn't "This Means War" have a bit where Harry tries to ignore Ginny's blatant flirting by imagining Umbridge in a bikini? That is a mental picture that is so wrong on so many levels.

    You have to ask Josh about that. In one of his stories Ridiculous "while Voldemort stared in confusion at him, Harry pictured Voldemort in her (Rita Skinner) hideous makeup and dubiously fashionable clothing."

    As for the title Naked Once More, that was the title of a real book. Alright, a parody of "Bodice Rippers" in which the first best seller of the fictitious author was "Naked on The Ice" (historical romance among cave people) Naked Once More was the runaway bestselling sequel. A very funny book about a new author's struggles with a publishing company

    Rhetor's picture

    Nail on the head

    SiblingCreature wrote:

    Most of what he said makes a lot of sense, but he doesn't seem to have taken into consideration (or was perhaps ignoring as being irrelevant to his point) the fact that every professional writer has to start somewhere, and in this day and age it makes sense that making use of the 'fanzine press' as he puts it is one of the possible steps along that path.

    Yes, exactly. Nail on the head.